View Full Version : Speaking of Clones?


hookedtrout
04/02/2005, 10:46 PM
Where does this fit in? Isn't this basically a clone, a 68 Mustang converted to a Shelby in modern times, by Shelby?

Shelby G.T.500E Convertible Fetches World Record $550,800 at Barrett-Jackson Palm Beach Auction

http://www.barrett-jackson.com/

http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/050402/25068.html?.v=1

I'd say Shelby has defintely sold out for the money. No way I'd pay that kind of money for a clone when you could have the real deal for half that much. ::)

hookedtrout
04/03/2005, 07:06 PM
I find it odd that no one comments on the new old Shelby. Let me ask these questions, isn't this the ultimate clone?

What effect does this have on the Shelby world?

Does this lessen or increase the worth of an original Shelby?

Should this be considered an original Shelby?

Who should have the authority to create something new from something old and call it new/old stock?

This being the case if GT/CS cars suddenly become the ultimate to own and value jumps to the 6 figures should Ford be able to go out and gather up all the 67, 68 coupes they can find and turn them into GT/CS's and head to Barrett Jackson to make a buck?

Or should we even care?

Food for thought.

Hook

PNewitt
04/03/2005, 08:11 PM
I totally agree, Hook.

However, in this day of "big money running over values", you will see cloned super-muscle cars going for big bucks. I think it was a Yanko Chevelle (??) clone that got six figures, because the buyer just wanted one, and had the cash.

I wonder what would happen if there were cloned Superbirds and Daytonas sold at auction for $140K??

This is a much bigger "problem" that enthusiasts need to address and think over. I don't have a quick answer--but I can see that all of you are quite vigilant to keep the breed of THIS Mustang marque pure!!

Paul N.

case12
04/04/2005, 07:16 AM
Just a few excerpts from SAAC on how they deal with this - at least the cobra's - I also like their themes: Preservation, Care (Maintenance), History, Enjoyment. Casey

"We now find that as the value of Cobras and Shelbys continues to appreciate, the cars have been priced beyond the means of some people who still want to be SAAC members. These people have opted to own Cobra replicas, Shelby look-alikes and other Ford performance cars of which there is presently no shortage. The national club is happy to have these people as participating members, and they add a lot to the club. We like to think of them as potential Cobra or Shelby owners. However, they should not expect that we will suddenly change the club’s policy to include cars outside of our purview as equal partners to Cobras and Shelbys."

"As far as CSX4000 and CSX7000 cars are concerned, SAAC accepts these cars as genuine Shelby American Cobras (as opposed to "original" Shelby American Cobras). The definition we use to identify an original Cobra is one which was, 1) built between 1961 and 1968, 2) at the direction of and under contract from Carroll Shelby/Shelby American Inc., and 3) sold by Shelby American or one of its franchised dealers. The only difference between original Cobras and CSX4000 and CSX7000 cars is the time frame in which they were built (1). However, all three factors separate Shelby’s current cars from all the rest of the Cobra replicas, AC MK IVs, COB/COX continuation cars, etc. So, to our way of thinking, the current crop of Cobras are genuine but are not original."

www.saac.com

Mustanglvr
04/04/2005, 08:46 AM
So where does that put the California Special?

Rhonda

hookedtrout
04/04/2005, 09:17 AM
I guess the odd thing is that the entire idea yanks me in two different directions at the same time. The word clone itself gives you the feeling of cheating or dishonest when you hear it, yet you think a person can't afford some of the high dollar cars so cloning one for personal enjoyment may be OK as there is no way the common man on an average salary can play at the high end level yet he has a love for the car so he makes himself one so he can play. Then you have Mr. Shelby the idol cloning at the highest level at what appears pretty obviously to me purely for profit.

So then you ask is it or isn't it ok. I certainly can't condemn a common person for cloning a car for themselves and support the cloning of Shelbys sold in 500,000 range by the creator himself.

Hook

case12
04/04/2005, 11:49 AM
So where does that put the California Special?

Rhonda
California Specials were built in the FORD factory to be sold by FORD dealers in the "original" era. So, they are pure bred mustangs from FORD using Shelby parts, and with a Shelby history (the coupe prototypes). That is what makes our cars so cool and unique to me - a little bit of Shelby touch on the FORD. Casey

jk89cat
04/04/2005, 12:00 PM
i dont think of as a big deal , (my 67 is gonna a be a cs clone btw) it doesnt affect values like everyone thinks. i have to find the article i think it was hemming new magazine. that the magority of people buying hte clones. dont want to spend x amount of dollars on a high buck muscle car and use like its intended. now the trick is to document the clones where the dishonest sellers are not trying to push it off as orginal. the article also said that the thing with the total performance e500 cars is that they are putting decent cars back on the road rather than seeing them rot into oblivion . and also it makes people that couldnt afford a orginal or restored high dollar car be able to have something close to what they wanted. now , why am i making my coupe into a clone? my car is missing almost all of its exterior body panels, the only body i have is the shell, and the doors , a drivers seat and a driveline that doesnt run. and its not going to be 100% a cs/gt clone anyhow , its gonna be a mix between that and a r model shelby with a mix of late model . it would be different if my car wasnt missign so many parts , but i am gonna make it to be what i want and dont plan on selling it either. justin

Mustanglvr
04/04/2005, 01:00 PM
But Case, would`nt the California Special fall under the same criteria you mentioned in your earlier post? (1) Built between 1961 and 1968. (2) At the direction of Shelby American. (3) Sold by Shelby or one of its franchised dealers.
Paul said the GT/CS was 75 to 80% Shelby. Should`nt it be considered a Shelby? What does the SAAC say about the GT/CS? Rhonda

case12
04/04/2005, 01:37 PM
I dont think the GT/CS meets #2, or #3, since it was not built under the direction of Shelby American, but built under the direction of FORD - and since it was not sold through Shelby dealers, but sold through FORD dealers.

I dont know what SAAC says about the GT/CS. Paul is the expert at that, and has a lot of experience with them.

That said, see my post string about the Boss & GT/CS. Seems to me that if the Boss can merit ties to Shelby, then the GT/CS has even closer ties. Casey

coloradoHCS
04/04/2005, 07:28 PM
"However, in this day of "big money running over values", you will see cloned super-muscle cars going for big bucks. I think it was a Yanko Chevelle (??) clone that got six figures, because the buyer just wanted one, and had the cash.

I wonder what would happen if there were cloned Superbirds and Daytonas sold at auction for $140K??"
Paul N

Paul, you guessed it. The May 2005 issue of " Car Collector Magazine" lists the results of nationwide car auctions and last month a 1971 Plymouth Barracuda hardtop, not even a 'Cuda, with a 426 Hemi installed and listed as a Hemi Clone sold for $157,500 plus 8% commission resulting in a final sale price of $170,100 for a clone. The car was originally a 318/230 HP car. The editors of "Car Collector" noted that the buyer "got some sort of showoff opportunity, but little of lasting value"