Oil Pump Pickup/Pan clearance issue Technical Assistance

[miller511]

Hi All,

I'm in the process of assembling my new long block 347.

One issue that is concerning me in this assembly process- The oil pan "slightly" touches the oil pump pickup assembly when dry fitting the pan (with the oil pan gasket in place). I can hear it touching when I set the pan in place.
I read somewhere that the clearance should be between the pan and pickup should be 1/4" to 3/8" (not sure if this was for Ford or in general)

Does anyone know if this is correct for a 302 block? Should it sit right on the bottom of the pan? The logical answer to me would be to have a slight gap between the pan and pickup.

I've put both the original pump and pickup from my old engine, as well as the new pump and pickup on (Using the same pan from my old engine). They fit the same. The pickup is sitting right against the bottom of the pan in both cases. Functionally, it worked fine in my old 302 engine.

Will put some pics of the engine up soon, too.

Thanks, Jeff

 

[rvrtrash]

The pickup shouldn't be touching the pan. 1/4"-3/8" sounds right to me, though I don't have anything in writing to prove it. Is it possible the pickup tube is bent or you have the wrong one? If you're building a 347, I'd strongly recommend going with an aftermarket pickup and screen anyway. The Ford ones aren't all that great.

Steve

 

[miller511]

Thanks Steve. I appreciate your input...as always.

Was looking at the Miloden line of products while over at Mustangs Plus today.

Here's a pic. The actual color of the painted block didn't come across real well in this pic. It is much darker.

-Jeff

 

[rvrtrash]

That looks like it'll be just too much fun! Are you going to run headers or the stock manifolds? I have Thorley Tri-Y's on mine and love them. When I installed them, I was putting them in from the top and they actually slid through until they hit the garage floor. In other words, easy install.

Steve

 

[Perkchiro]

Thanks Steve. I appreciate your input...as always.

Was looking at the Miloden line of products while over at Mustangs Plus today.

Here's a pic. The actual color of the painted block didn't come across real well in this pic. It is much darker.

-Jeff

Jeff, Very cool engine project. Love those Edelbrock heads, true double roller timing chain and especially those freshly painted stock manifolds. Keep those pics coming as you progress. Great Job!:smile:

 

[joedls]

That engine looks like it's coming along nicely!!! You gotta get it running soon, though. It's time to drive. :grin:

 

[miller511]

That looks like it'll be just too much fun! Are you going to run headers or the stock manifolds? I have Thorley Tri-Y's on mine and love them. When I installed them, I was putting them in from the top and they actually slid through until they hit the garage floor. In other words, easy install.

Steve

Steve,

Good info on the Thorley Tri-Y's.

To answer your question, For the time being, I'm going with the stock exhaust manifolds. (I know I should do just put the headers on now, but it's a funding issue. And I'm anxious to get the CS back on the road soon.) It was 80 degrees here today and it was rough not being able to drive the CS

Also, I figured out that the oil pump pickup was not touching the pan. It was the sound of the pan touching the one-piece gasket that I bought that is sort of a rubberized outer with a metal inner and around the bolt holes. It resonated in a way that I swore was the sound of the pickup touching the pan. As a sanity test, I measured the depth of the pan from the lip to the deep part of the sump and also the height of the pickup from the block...plenty of room.

-Jeff

 

[miller511]

Hi all,

Getting closer...Still have to do some additional detailing of the engine bay before I drop the motor in.

Question- Is there any techniques I need to know about with regards to installing the new torque converter?

I thought I read somewhere that it'll kind of hit a stop, then turn it a little and push it the rest of the way on?


Thanks, Jeff

 

[Mustanger]

Jeff,

That's a real nice pic of your motor ... I bet you're getting real eager to drop it into place and startin' it up ...

 

[miller511]

Yep, I'm pretty eager to get her going. It's getting very tough to stay patient at this point ;-)

I think one of the cooler things about this engine project is having my son helping me. He's learned a lot going through the tear down of the old motor and re-assembly process of the new long block.

-Jeff

 

[Mustanger]

Yep, I'm pretty eager to get her going. It's getting very tough to stay patient at this point ;-)

I think one of the cooler things about this engine project is having my son helping me. He's learned a lot going through the tear down of the old motor and re-assembly process of the new long block.

-Jeff

Jeff,

Just a little curious, what happened to the previous motor? ...

 

[miller511]

The old motor-
Although it sounded good with the glass pack exhaust that is on the CS, it really didn't have much power. I thought I might rebuild it, even after finding that it was not the original numbers matching 289. It ended up being a 302 bored out .030" over. The cast iron heads were in need of rebuilding. I went ahead and took the bare block to a local speed shop to have them magnaflux it and check it to see if it could be built up. It is rebuildable. They were going to do it and bore it out to .040" over. But it was going to be quite expensive in my opinion for them to build it into a stroker.
So, long story long, I started looking at crate motors. Started doing the math and went with Coast High Performance's Stree Fighter GT long block (new block, one-piece rear seal, Edelbrock Perf. RPM heads, roller assembly, etc.)

If anyone is interested in a 1969 casting 302 block and/or any of the parts I have left over (heads, crank, rods, etc), let me know.

-Jeff

 

[rvrtrash]

Hi all,

Question- Is there any techniques I need to know about with regards to installing the new torque converter?

I thought I read somewhere that it'll kind of hit a stop, then turn it a little and push it the rest of the way on?

Thanks, Jeff

That's pretty much it. You'll probably actually have to wiggle it around a bit, rotating side to side, etc. to get it to mesh up and go on. MAKE SURE the tranny is flush with the block before you start your first bolt. It's easy to try and use the bolts to bring it up tight and break off chunks of your tranny or bell housing.

Steve

 

[Perkchiro]

Jeff, Make sure you torque the nuts properly that hold the torque converter to the flex plate. Ask me how I know .

 

[miller511]

Steve and Steve,

Thanks for the real world advice guys. Would hate to crack the bell housing or have a torque converter nut rattling around in there later.

-Jeff

 

[miller511]

Got the engine dropped in last night. After some technical difficulties...Some lessons learned that I'd like to pass along.

I thought I'd pushed the torque converter all the way in (looked/felt like it was in) onto the splines on the transmission. I started lining up the flex plate to the torque converter holes. Everything was looking good. Then I noticed the block and bell housing did NOT sit flush with each other. I had about an inch of clearance between block and bell housing. Bummer. I had to take the engine back out. Climbed into the engine bay and wiggled (a lot!!) to get the torque converter to drop further in. I double-checked the depth this time by holding the starter up to where it mounts and seeing where the gear was (and where it pushes out when engaging the flex plate teeth). Looked good this time.
Second attempt, the engine went in like buttah!!

 

[robert campbell]

Jeff,
I am all over the site tonight. I guess since you have started it that I am way to late. The best way to install the torque convertor is to stand it up on its end with the tranny front straight up. Be careful to not hurt the tranny seal on the tail house. What I do is pour a couple quarts of tranny fluid in the torque convertor first. Start it on the tranny laying on the floor horizontally. Engage the convertor the best you can while in the horizontal position. Now have some one help you tip it up front first. Now carefully rotate it round slowly. Make sure you do not have your fingers between the convertor and the inside of the bell house. It will drop suddenly and ow ow ow if your fingers are behind it!!! Now you know it is all the way engaged. Ensure when you install that it does not move forward. Allready has a couple quarts in it and will not hurt it when you start it up and pour the rest in!!

Rob